2021-09-13 04:10:47 <veltas      > feoh: What even is LOGO? Is it a graphics DSL?
2021-09-13 04:11:15 <veltas      > I don't think it's particularly harmful, only as harmful as kids learning HTML
2021-09-13 04:13:23 <eris[m]     > LOGO is a learning PL
2021-09-13 11:39:44 <feoh        > I wasn't saying it's harmful. There's a HUGE difference between a thing not being particularly well designed and it being harmful.
2021-09-13 11:41:52 <feoh        > LOGO is a variant of LISP with a more ALGOL like syntax. Various implementations were stripped down to greater or lesser extents.  Brian Harvey's version, Berkeley Logo, retained way more of LISP's features and he even wrote a series of books on teaching CS with the language. They're pretty good.
2021-09-13 11:44:18 <feoh        > What I meant is that due to the language being an adaptation of LISP but with supposedly more palatable syntax, there are aspects of working in it that are somewhat less than elegant. For instance, the way you say N=N+1 in LOGO is: MAKE "N :N + 1 or something similar
2021-09-13 11:44:49 <feoh        > I'm a bit of a LOGO fan despite the language's warts. ATARI LOGO was the first programming language I truly fell in love with.
2021-09-13 12:58:22 <veltas      > feoh: I don't mean 'harmful' seriously
2021-09-13 13:16:53 <hexagon5un  > "just teach your kid Forth"  I know, right?  But he's got this book series where LOGO is an integral part, and it'd be so cool to see a bot run out some of the patterns IRL.  I'm afraid it's got to be LOGO.
2021-09-13 13:17:20 <f-a         > of course it has to be logo
2021-09-13 13:17:31 <f-a         > let’s be honest a kid will digest logo way better than forth
2021-09-13 13:17:47 <hexagon5un  > anti-patterns don't bug me at the moment either -- it's git 'er done time.  :)
2021-09-13 13:18:41 <hexagon5un  > getting word definitions to work with logo syntax is possible: the passed arguments is trickier, but I'm going to punt on that for now
2021-09-13 13:19:56 <hexagon5un  > TO myroutine  forward 40 right 90  end   is simply a matter of aliasing "to" to ":" and "end" to ";"
2021-09-13 13:21:09 <hexagon5un  > handling "repeat 4 [ forward 40 right 90 ]" is where I'm stuck at the moment, and I haven't gotten to nested repeats yet.
2021-09-13 14:24:54 <veltas      > "let's be honest a kid will digest logo way better than forth" I'm not 100% sure about that
2021-09-13 14:25:04 <veltas      > Only way to find out is to experiment on live children
2021-09-13 14:30:33 <veltas      > I was talking recently to someone at work who learned BASIC, then assembly, then Forth, then C. They found C the hardest language and took them ages to 'get it'.
2021-09-13 14:31:19 <veltas      > Worked with Forth on controllers for those machines that americans call "elevators"
2021-09-13 19:31:39 <imode       > kids understand recipes. they understand sequential instructions.
2021-09-13 19:31:59 <imode       > stands to reason they'll understand any language so long as the notation is as straightforward as a recipe.