2024-12-29 00:11:52 "learning how to learn" reports various amounts of crossover of problem solving skills between unrelated domains 2024-12-29 00:13:18 what does? 2024-12-29 00:51:55 In a business though you don't want you to spend most of your time reinventing the wheel, you want to demonstrate value on a regular and frequent basis 2024-12-29 00:53:39 UNIX took a big old failed OS project and quickly demonstrated value as a number of things, including typesetting for the patent department if I remember right? 2024-12-29 00:54:06 And clearly iterated a lot before becoming the monster(s) it is now 2024-12-29 00:54:49 And there was some unnecessary work in there, which their employer could afford 2024-12-29 00:57:01 Not all employers can afford that 2024-12-29 00:57:25 And a lot of innovations are made in companies with a lot of money and no clue where the value is 2024-12-29 01:00:36 the UNIX creators were also fond of such business software as 'space war' and 'rogue' 2024-12-29 01:12:46 Yes, typesetting for the patent guys was part of how they justified their work, so they made sure to deliver on that. 2024-12-29 01:18:38 https://thrig.me/tmp/games.png 2024-12-29 01:55:50 I am writing a Forth interpreter in C, following along “Starting Forth” to teach myself C and writing interpreters. Does anyone have good examples of well-documented Forth implementations in C? 2024-12-29 02:00:50 I liked PFE 2024-12-29 02:01:23 right, typesetting for the patent department. but Unix was also happening inside Bell Labs where people didn't have to demonstrate value on a regular and frequent basis 2024-12-29 02:01:54 SpaceWar! never ran on Unix, and Rogue was by other people a decade later 2024-12-29 02:03:00 you are probably thinking of Space Travel: https://www.bell-labs.com/usr/dmr/www/ken-games.html 2024-12-29 04:25:48 guys, i'm sorry to say forth is dead to me. i'm getting into operation: flashpoint scripting now. 2024-12-29 04:27:01 this is the most laughably shittiest language. i wonder what it was like to work in the office that made this. 2024-12-29 04:28:57 constructs like while (cond) do {body} but the kicker is a newline anywhere in there, including the body, is a syntax error, and lines are limited to 4096 characters 2024-12-29 04:30:54 so you end up writing loops with labels and conditional gotos like you're writing assembly just so you get your newlines back 2024-12-29 04:38:01 function calls are all infix operators, so you have weird stuff like dir = (pos select 1) atan2 (pos select 0) and you gotta make judicious use of the parens because who knows wtf the precedence is of something like getPos units group player select 1 2024-12-29 04:42:35 there's no for loop; there's a forEach, but again it's infix and is constrained to the all-on-one-line rule. {body} forEach array and there are just magic variables, like in a forEach body _x refers to the currect item. i guess that's kind of like forth's "i" and "j". 2024-12-29 04:53:58 haha 2024-12-29 04:54:11 that sounds like old Microsoft BASIC 2024-12-29 04:55:01 where you could say IF X = 3 THEN IQ = IQ + 1 : DX = DX - 1 : GOTO 473 ELSE ST = ST + 1 : GOTO 1492 2024-12-29 04:55:51 or indeed IFX=3THENIQ=IQ+1:DX=DX-1:GOTO473ELSEST=ST+1:GOTO1492 2024-12-29 04:56:11 the conditional would terminate at the end of the line, see 2024-12-29 04:56:31 yeah come to think of it, it probably is kind of basic-ish. i never used basic so i couldn't say for sure. 2024-12-29 04:57:07 it sounds like someone started out with a need for scripting and didn't think they really needed a language 2024-12-29 08:44:11 I think it was started in the 90's, so BASIC-ish isn't surprising. In the 90's BASIC was the first language a lot of people learned. Even in 00's this was the case. 2024-12-29 08:49:46 what, operation flashpoint? 2024-12-29 08:50:50 Yeah 2024-12-29 09:02:58 https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/making-of-flashpoint 2024-12-29 23:09:06 both forth and lisp have been shoved into boot sectors 2024-12-29 23:10:44 The sector lisp is more lispy than the sector forths are forthy 2024-12-29 23:10:59 But neither are really familiar to people who like those languages anyway 2024-12-29 23:13:27 "starvation diet produces thin gurus regardless of whether it's a lisp guru or a forth guru" 2024-12-29 23:15:42 Also who cares which is smaller, they're both small enough to understand and write yourself 2024-12-29 23:18:11 well, if Forth were much smaller and simpler, it might be reasonable to write a Forth implementation as a stepping stone to writing a Lisp implementation