2025-09-22 16:43:44 <user51      > wanted to say nice comment to xentrac, but he's not here.  has he been on lately?
2025-09-22 16:44:05 <user51      > the comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45333605
2025-09-22 16:46:49 <user51      > also, how can i get an f83 running?
2025-09-22 16:52:14 <crc         > user51: on the 5th: https://forth.chat/logs/libera/forth/2025-09-05.html
2025-09-22 16:53:45 <user51      > crc: thanks.  i used to autojoin this channel but lost interest in forth.  maybe i just needed to take a break :)
2025-09-22 16:54:20 <crc         > breaks can be good :)
2025-09-22 16:56:19 <user51      > tbh, i've been thinking that traditional forth is a bit behind the times, and that maybe there's modern ideas that could be used.
2025-09-22 16:57:45 <bjorkintosh > user51: behind in what terms? what do you want it to do for you?
2025-09-22 16:58:37 <user51      > bjorkintosh: dunno, just a thought.
2025-09-22 16:59:30 <bjorkintosh > perhaps it's too low level for your needs?
2025-09-22 16:59:34 <user51      > bjorkintosh: perhaps i should make a two-column table of ideas to keep and ideas to throw.
2025-09-22 17:00:10 <tpbsd       > I find traditional Forth utterly useless for developing embedded applications on Cortex-M, but I've been working on fixing that for a few years
2025-09-22 17:01:48 <tpbsd       > I'm not far away from releasing my solution which I call "FURS" or the "Forth Upload Replacement System". Ive been updating the doc over the last week
2025-09-22 17:01:59 <bjorkintosh > you'll find ARM assembly utterly useless on a forth microprocessor, similarly tpbsd. when in Rome and whatnot ...
2025-09-22 17:02:49 <tpbsd       > basically FURS just provides a similar facility to Forth that headers and includes provide to C (for embedded)
2025-09-22 17:04:23 <user51      > bjorkintosh: on the other hand, i'm not exactly sure if i have a good definition of 'forth' anyway.  rpn + dictionary + stacks more or less?
2025-09-22 17:05:18 <tpbsd       > user51, thats about it really, tho realtime development using the REPL is the killer attraction
2025-09-22 17:05:20 <bjorkintosh > user51: other way around. stack first ...
2025-09-22 17:05:35 <bjorkintosh > then operations on the stack
2025-09-22 17:06:00 <bjorkintosh > plus a dictionary, which is really just a table.
2025-09-22 17:06:01 <user51      > bjorkintosh: i dunno.  what about 'everything is a word'?
2025-09-22 17:06:29 <bjorkintosh > ... or a number
2025-09-22 17:06:39 <user51      > well, that's probably not accurate, and you can probably notice the unix in that
2025-09-22 17:07:15 <bjorkintosh > the bumper sticker CS slogan didn't start with unix I don't think.
2025-09-22 17:07:18 <user51      > maybe 'everything has a meaning' is better, but i think 'word' is a bit better from a human-computer interaction
2025-09-22 17:08:08 <tpbsd       > bjorkintosh, I wasnt aware that there are any 'forth microprocessors' in common use thesedays ? I thought the 'Novix' was the last of that breed ?
2025-09-22 17:08:25 <bjorkintosh > user51: here's a list: https://wiki.c2.com/?EverythingIsa
2025-09-22 17:08:50 <tpbsd       > and GArrays is so odd, I cant say anything about that
2025-09-22 17:08:51 <bjorkintosh > tpbsd: well, some VMs are stack machines. and you can always go the fpga route.
2025-09-22 17:10:10 <tpbsd       > bjorkintosh, no, I cant go the fpga route for a few reasons, 1. very expensive, 2. very slow for 'affordable models', and tons of work
2025-09-22 17:10:46 <bjorkintosh > YMMV
2025-09-22 17:11:34 <user51      > bjorkintosh: fwiw, why stacks first?
2025-09-22 17:12:07 <bjorkintosh > user51: consider the simplicity.
2025-09-22 17:12:13 <bjorkintosh > all you gotta do is consider what's on top of the stack.
2025-09-22 17:12:16 <tpbsd       > bjorkintosh, Im not so sure MMMV as fpga is like a gas guzzler when it comes to cost, i.e. they always get terrible mileage
2025-09-22 17:12:45 <bjorkintosh > tpbsd: when you come to a fork in the road, dine. if not, skip it :-)
2025-09-22 17:12:51 <bjorkintosh > if it doesn't meet your needs, don't use it.
2025-09-22 17:14:23 <user51      > bjorkintosh: seems a bit.. stack-sighted :P  ime i often end up using some stack manipulation words to handle that
2025-09-22 17:16:10 <crc         > I've not used traditional forths in many years, apart from testing code from others
2025-09-22 17:16:12 <bjorkintosh > all computing is 'doing something with memory'.
2025-09-22 17:16:28 <bjorkintosh > there are 2 broad kinds, random access (which is a giant array) or stack.
2025-09-22 17:16:34 <bjorkintosh > that's what it boils down to.
2025-09-22 17:27:21 <cleobuli_   > forthBot:  S" bjorkintosh  programming forth "S IMAGE
2025-09-22 17:27:42 <forthBot    > https://i.ibb.co/7JkGYzCp/mforth-image-x7m-Rkf.png
2025-09-22 17:28:14 <cleobuli_   > mmmm !
2025-09-22 17:37:38 <bjorkintosh > funny.
2025-09-22 17:53:43 <cleobuli_   > you are a pretty girl bjorkintosh ...
2025-09-22 17:54:08 <bjorkintosh > sorry to dissapoint you cleobuli_. but that's not me in the image you just created.
2025-09-22 17:54:17 <bjorkintosh > also, on the internet no one can tell if you're a dog.
2025-09-22 17:54:29 <bjorkintosh > 
ACTION might actually be a snail.

2025-09-22 18:08:50 <ajhidd      > "Never look at fingers on images that AI has created..." And now that I know this rule I always break it... >.<
2025-09-22 19:27:42 <forthBot    > Environment for cleobuli_ inactive, freeing...
2025-09-22 19:54:17 <crc         > testing something for forth.chat: http://88.99.92.114:12456/ is a thing for searching the logs
2025-09-22 22:22:06 <tpnix       > crc, I just ran some searches and generally tested your app, it's fast and works well, looks great
2025-09-22 22:22:36 <tpnix       > crc, it formats the searches and log nicely
2025-09-22 22:23:54 <tpnix       > crc, Im using the Brave browser
2025-09-22 22:34:30 <cleobuli_   > forthBot:  S" un montre affreux avec des gros yeux des grandes dents et des tentacules "S IMAGE
2025-09-22 22:34:43 <forthBot    > https://i.ibb.co/4nn0GmFW/mforth-image-AH5-Vy-E.png
2025-09-22 22:43:37 <ajhidd      > And I could not even open it
2025-09-22 22:44:39 <cleobuli_   > why ?
2025-09-22 22:45:41 <cleobuli_   > there is no fingers ajhidd
2025-09-22 22:45:45 <ajhidd      > cleobuli_: I'm talking about crc's app :)
2025-09-22 22:45:57 <cleobuli_   > ha ok
2025-09-22 22:53:07 <crc         > ajhidd: what browser & os?
2025-09-22 22:53:24 <ajhidd      > Brave on Windows 10
2025-09-22 22:55:57 <ajhidd      > (Brave) ERR_CONNECTION_RESET. It's accessible with a web proxy, so I do not think it's browser/OS issue
2025-09-22 22:56:53 <cleobuline  > it works for me
2025-09-22 23:04:53 <crc         > I'll look at the configuration tonight
2025-09-22 23:08:58 <crc         > there's no https on this server and no domain name, not sure if either of those might affect anything with connecting
2025-09-22 23:13:24 <cleobuline  > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpmehTYs8pY
2025-09-22 23:15:32 <ajhidd      > crc: Do not waste your time on this :) I presume the host is blocking access from Russian ISPs. It's not the other way around because I can ping the address, but cannot get answer with curl
2025-09-22 23:22:20 <crc         > ok, thanks for trying
2025-09-22 23:22:55 <crc         > I do see some articles mentioning hetzner blocking some russian access, so that might be it
2025-09-22 23:23:57 <crc         > (this dev box is a hetzner server, my primary servers are openbsd.amsterdam & linode)
2025-09-22 23:26:20 <ajhidd      > At least I still have access to forth.works, konilo.org and retroforth.org :)
2025-09-22 23:35:29 <crc         > When I'm done with this, it'll be accessible from the server hosting the .org's